A wave of international recognitions of a Palestinian state has prompted bitter and almost unanimous condemnation across the political spectrum in Israel, uniting political foes and, analysts said, potentially reinforcing the ruling coalition’s grip on power.
Benjamin Netanyahu, Israeli’s prime minister, called the moves an “absurdity” on Sunday night, and a “reward for terrorism”, while Israel’s president said the “forces of darkness” would be emboldened.
Opposition leaders have used similar language. Yair Lapid, who heads the centrist Yesh Atid party, described “a diplomatic disaster, a bad move and a reward for terror”.
But there was little prospect of Israel’s government changing course as a result of the recognitions, experts said.
“This will not have one millimetre of influence on policymaking,” said Yaakov Amidror, a former national security adviser to Netanyahu and analyst at the Jerusalem Institute for Strategic Studies, a conservative thinktank.
Netanyahu leads the most far-right government in Israel’s history and his coalition is in part dependent on the continuing support of extremist religious Zionist factions, which have a messianic vision of Israel’s destiny, and ultra-Orthodox religious parties.
“K, so they’re all dead now. Declare Palestine a state? Sure. It was a state. It’s in quite a state right now, actually. Who wants to clean up? Hey, get Donny on the line…!”
Maybe it’s time to get those Israeli’s out of that land and have them wander around for a while, like the old days. It’ll give them a chance to think about what they’ve done.
Further evidence that balkanization won’t solve anything. The only way to peace is a total worldwide boycott of Israel until the regime falls and then the establishment of one secular state that isn’t inherently abusive and oppressive based on ethnicity, religion, and ancestry.
It worked with the South African Apartheid regime in the 90s and if it’ll work with the Israeli apartheid regime now.
Honestly, I don’t see how either solution can work. In a two-state solution, Palestine doesn’t look like it would be functional with those kinds of borders, and in a one-state solution, I don’t see how there won’t be extreme ethnic conflict after everything that’s happened.
I mean.
“Worked” is a pretty generous term to use for South Africa.
Everything I hear about it says that it’s a borderline failed state rife with violence.
Obviously keeping apartheid going would have been fucking monstrous but the country is not exactly thriving.
“Worked” is a pretty generous term to use for South Africa.
Everything I hear about it says that it’s a borderline failed state rife with violence.
Might want to be more critical of your sources. While there’s indeed significant problems, the extent is exaggerated to extreme degrees by white supremacists and other people who want it to return to Apartheid.
Besides, much like the US since the civil war, conditions would be worse in the short term but MUCH better now if not for the leniency of the ANC with regards to the Apartheid regime and its enablers.
Actually holding the Israeli apartheid regime and its enablers both domestic and international responsible for their crimes against humanity is a necessary part of the path to lasting peace and justice.
https://travel.gc.ca/destinations/south-africa
I can find sources that talk about how dangerous the country is for days, but my governments travel warning recently made me rethink a trip to Nepal so they have my faith.
I really don’t think it is exaggerated.
You know that it’s possible to admit that the country has major fucking problems and also believe that apartheid is a horrible and inhuman system of oppression right?
To refine the point you made: white supremacists exaggerate the black on white crime in South Africa to argue for a return to apartheid. To acknowledge the high incidence of violent crime in the country is entirely different than cherry picking or making up facts to support a narrow and racist agenda.
The solution is neither a return to apartheid nor is it, obviously, the state of things now. I don’t know what the solution is, but I’d hope that it’s racially inclusive, equitable, and democratic.
I agree with you wholeheartedly about the very real need for justice against the monsters prosecuting the genocide in Palestine so that the surviving victims may one day live freely. I hope that the international community comes around on this sooner than later.
Yeah. Canada also has the same level of warning for Italy and most of Western Europe. I’m in Italy and the warning level seems alarming compared to the reality. I find it interesting that Canada doesn’t have the same level for the USA frankly. It makes me wonder about the diplomacy of the warnings compared to the factual reality.
You know that it’s possible to admit that the country has major fucking problems and also believe that apartheid is a horrible and inhuman system of oppression right?
Yep. Which is why I did exactly that.
To acknowledge the high incidence of violent crime in the country is entirely different than cherry picking or making up facts to support a narrow and racist agenda.
Agreed. I’m pretty sure that acknowledging that the country DOES have serious problems happened in/from the first or second sentence in my reply to you, so it’s almost impressive that you seem to have missed it completely.
The solution is neither a return to apartheid nor is it, obviously, the state of things now. I don’t know what the solution is, but I’d hope that it’s racially inclusive, equitable, and democratic
Again, we agree.
I don’t know what the solution is, but I’d hope that it’s racially inclusive, equitable, and democratic
Same. Except I know what the start of the solution is: a worldwide diplomatic and economic boycott of Israel like we successfully did with Apartheid South Africa in the 90s.
The regime won’t be able to continue their crimes against humanity with impunity once the economic and military support from Western allies dries up and when they are a pariah state that can’t participate in any international events and can’t sell any goods and services to the outside world either, the population WILL eventually revolt and overthrow it.
Not saying it can’t happen, but you’re gonna have to boycott the US, too, or they’ll just keep getting propped up. It’s a religious zeal for some, they won’t be convinced of anything.
At this point, if you aren’t already boycotting the US, no matter where you live, I’d go so far to say that you’re being an irresponsible adult.
Add it to the pile of reasons to boycott the US
the US is boycotting itself at the moment
I’m doing my part!
while Israel’s president said the “forces of darkness” would be emboldened.
Such fucking clowns. The fact that the criticism comes from all sides for the Israeli political spectrum is also enough to tell you that Israel is completely united in its intent of genocide. There is no meaningful opposition even if they make a theater out of “ceasefire” deals. They are always only thinking about their own lives, never others.
The ones who were quoted are either center or right wing.
And even the centrists have been calling to get out of Gaza for over a year nowYes but not because they think killing palestinians is wrong. Its because the war isnt profitable and because jewish Israelis are dying while committing their genocide. The Israeli politician cares about nothing but their ethnostate.
You’re thinking of right wingers.
You can find quotes of centrists like Yair Lapid decrying harming innocent Palestinians, and calling WB settlers “Jewish terrorists”.And that’s without mentioning Israel’s left wing politicians.
while Israel’s president said the “forces of darkness” would be emboldened.
He’s right. Israel’s campaign of genocide and ethnic cleansing will escalate, emboldened by spite.
Fascist politics always boil down to “I know what you are but what am I?”
We need to stop the weapon flow and defend Gaza from zionist invaders.
This political reapobse will lend a lot of credibility to Palestinian and allied voices who’ve been saying this forever.
All theater. This Palestinian recognition is only coming after Israel completed a majority of their mission. Israel will pretend they’re mad about this while secretly high fiving these countries under the table. Jobs done, and every one of these countries “recognizing” Palestine are complicit.
Instead of celebrating this controlled opposition we should be demanding western world leaders be put in prison for allowing this.
International support of Palestine can be improved with state recognition. Let’s not forget that Israel also has their sights on Lebanon and Syria.
Instead of celebrating this controlled opposition we should be demanding western world leaders be put in prison for allowing this.
That’s letting the perfect be the enemy of the good. You’re dismissing what should be seen as a sign of at least some progress in exchange for demanding something that’s simply not going to happen.
lmao at using the “dont let perfect be the enemy of good” trope to defend literal genocide enablers. This recognition does literally nothing for Palestinians, and Israel is laughing all the way to the bank.
Recognizing Palestine as a country is essential to their liberation, but doing so after you aided and abetted a genocide is simply just PR. You fell for it.
This kind of black and white thinking is juvenile.
You can praise some progress towards something good while pointing out the fact that much more still needs to happen.
It can be both. It’s called nuance you nonce.
You so desperately want these western nations to be the good guys, when they are the constructors of this genocide to begin with. You are too emotionally invested in this to think clearly.
In what way am I “defending” genocide enablers?
Recognizing Palestine as a country is essential to their liberation
So, it’s a good thing then, yes? And it’s good when good things get done?
If you actually finished reading my last sentence you already have your answer. Otherwise there is a comprehension issue on your end.
I did read it. I disregarded it because it’s completely unclear what “falling for it” even means in this case.
Is saying “recognizing Palestine is a good thing” falling for PR? If so, when you said “Recognizing Palestine as a country is essential to their liberation” did you just fall for PR?
Reading comprehension has not been very kind to you. Devastating.
Genocide => Recognition of Statehood. Israelis should get it, shouldn’t they?
Jesus Christ, why do world leaders have to behave like spoiled children? It’s so shameful that these people get to decide the lives of millions, even when they’re not their own citizens.
You’re talking about Netanyahu, right? Right??
Of course, even if the current breed of country leaders has so many bad apples.
The powerful have manipulated people all too well.
Did they mention anywhere what borders? I’m guessing its going to be pre67 borders which is a complete non starter without significant diplomatic work from both sides and neither are even close to working something like that out.
Maybe its current borders with land swaps for settlements in the west bank and Gaza to remain under occupation. I can’t see anywhere that they clarify what they are actually recognising as the Palestinian state so its ringing pretty dam hollow to me. Theyve also said they won’t accept hamas in power so I guess theyve managed to recognise something which no side agrees to which is so stupid.
Israel must be removed and destroyed
Israel, much like many other countries needs to go beyond capitalism.
This isn’t a “capitalism” problem. It’s plain old racism. You’ll find that happening in all sorts of different economic systems.
I think it’s both. There’s also the argument that racism (more specifically dehumanization) was fostered as a tool for acquiring new resources and people for capitalism to exploit during colonization. Removing racism from the equation but leaving capitalism in place would likely lead to fascism which would invent a new type of racism or discrimination. Removing capitalism from the equation would remove the economic pressure that drives racism and start further processes that contribute to lessening of racism and building solidarity across people.
Capitalism has only been around since the 1800s, and humans have been hating and killing people different from them for thousands of years.
I’m a socialist is well, but I don’t like how many people see socialism as a silver bullet for everything. I think it’s dangerous.
If we take socialism just to mean something like “workers are the ones who own the means of production; they take part in decision making and share the profits”, that doesn’t mean everything else will be solved. Some people will still be bigoted. Those (worker owned) companies will still have ads because they’ll still want to make money*. A lot might still give no fucks about the environment and keep polluting. And if it’s still a hierarchical system, there’s no reason those in power wouldn’t try to abuse that system, try to profit from it, oppress people, start wars, etc.
- Obviously the ads aren’t as bad as the rest, that feels a little out of place. I just mentioned it because I’ve had and seen conversation where people seem to think that marketing and advertising would go away without capitalism.
It’s not that socialism is a silver bullet that eliminates racism. It’s that capitalism makes it virtually impossible to stop competing for profit growth. This turns more nature and human labour into things, even if we throw those things away. That drives much higher exploitation of resources and people than needed to have decent average standard of living. And when some people organize to stop the explotation, racism is deployed to exploit more the groups that didn’t.
Socialism allows to stop the unlimited profit growth cycle and thus decrease the intensity of exploitation, which allows decreasing or stopping the explotation on the basis of racism. Doesn’t guarantee it but it surely makes it likely. Capitalism makes the opposite likely.
And that’s before we consider class consciousness’ effects on people.
Removing capitalism from the equation would drive even more demand for security and resources and put less pressure on playing nice with international markets.
