For Context: I’m Chinese American, and I do not feel “ashamed” for my heritage, neither do I feel “ashamed” for being a US Citizen.

The CCP is not my fault. I do not feel any shame of saying I’m from China.

Similarly, the trump admin is not my fault, I voted Harris. I do not feel any shame for being American.

So what is the thought process of people feeling shame/guilt?

  • MangioneDontMiss@feddit.nl
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    3 minutes ago

    I don’t know about others but I imagine for a lot its just guilt by association. I’ve definitely been feeling it for a while.

  • arnitbier@sh.itjust.works
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    30 minutes ago

    Because you are enjoying the fruits of all the evil/bad/indifference without doing stuff to prevent it and probably underhandedly excusing it

    Its funny, so much of this excuse is “well I didn’t do it myself so standing here and watching isn’t making me responsible morally lol” but it does indeed

    So mostly its because your very likely taking advantage of the situation and you know you shouldn’t and you SHOULD be shouldering the burden instead

    Its kinda morally reprehensible no matter the justification you sell yourself

    It sucks (the situation) and yeah that makes people fell bad

  • ilinamorato@lemmy.world
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    5 hours ago

    Speaking only for myself: because the American government has, for 250 years, claimed to act on behalf of the American people. When it was liberating concentration camps and sending people to the moon, that was something to be proud of.* When it was upholding slavery and winking at Jim Crow laws, it wasn’t.

    It’s a government “of the people, by the people, and for the people,” and so he purports to speak and act on my behalf. That’s deeply embarrassing and shameful, even if I couldn’t have done anything differently to prevent it.

    * (Yes, I know that even those “good” examples are complicated. I’m just forming an example here)

  • percent@infosec.pub
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    5 hours ago

    American tech companies created algorithms that happen to boost videos and news articles of fringe/extreme occurrences that take place here. The mainstream news networks also prioritize content like that, for the same reason: It’s very profitable. Boring news/content just doesn’t make much money.

    People who have never visited the US seem to have a very distorted understanding of what everyday life is like here. We display a pretty embarrassing caricature of our country for the world to see.

    And to make things even more embarrassing, we made our government ridiculous, and made our politics become pop culture (yet also very tribal) over the last ~15 years.

  • ameancow@lemmy.world
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    8 hours ago

    There’s a huge difference between being ashamed of your Government’s actions and behavior and being ashamed of who you are/where you were born.

    One is a valid criticism of the ruling class ignoring the people’s desire for peace and social responsibility. The other is a mental health issue much like some people who are ashamed of the race or gender they were born as.

    I get attacked by people unable to separate this conflation because I encourage people resistant to our government to pick up the goddamn American flag and wave it. To have some measure of pride in the institution we live in so others take it seriously when we demand improvement.

      • ameancow@lemmy.world
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        8 hours ago

        I genuinely feel like a lot of people don’t think very much about their feelings or where they come from, and end up with really mixed-up or inconsistent values.

        If you ask a lot of Americans why they feel the way they do about their country, negative or positive, they often become irritated or upset because most people just tie a lot of associations and emotions to other concepts and words. Which is fine, that’s how brains work. But I think if you’re involved in a democracy you should have some level of actual thought towards how you feel, what you want from your country and who should be representing those values. I can’t get people on either side of the political spectrum to care about any of that shit… which is why China will probably have the solar system in a generation.

        • China will probably have the solar system in a generation

          OMG I just had a thought.

          Remember what happened when Great Britain expanded and colonized stuff? 13 colonies?Independence?

          OMG wouldn’t it be cool if China did that to like Mars, then the Martian colonists be like, “no fuck you CCP”, then:

          Declaration of Independence

          United Provinces of Mars

          Constitution (hopefully a smarter constitution)

          Martian Revolution

          Becomes a Solar Superpower

          Chinese becomes the lingua franca of the solar system.

          Time is a circle lmao.

          Literally just The Expanse timeline, but without blue goo and Chinese becomes the lingua franca of the UN. LOL

          FOR MARS!

          火星联合众国

          • Soggy@lemmy.world
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            6 hours ago

            This is kind of the plot of Armored Core if you also made it a cyberpunk corporate dystopia.

          • ameancow@lemmy.world
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            8 hours ago

            Look, whatever you have to do to keep Elon out of the place, I am fully supportive.

            Seriously though, I was watching a documentary on the International Space Station a few days ago and listening to how this major network was hyping up such a “huge American engineering challenge” and “doing the impossible as the world watched on” and I couldn’t help but grumble “China has made three stations in half the time and those are just practice for an actual series of much bigger projects.” Literally, America gets almost NO news on progress and achievements outside of the USA.

  • captainlezbian@lemmy.world
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    8 hours ago

    Because I look at my country and what it’s done and feel insufficient for my failure to keep it from doing stupid and evil things.

    Also the European and Canadian frustration with America and Americans is understandable, but it has an impact especially when you still think highly of those places and their people.

  • BanMe@lemmy.world
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    14 hours ago

    We were raised with “pride,” not necessarily racially or ethnocentric, but a broader sense that transcended such boundaries. I grew up in the 80s-90s in the midwest, and we were taught America was a “melting pot” of cultures, ideas, and races, and that we should look forward to a time when whites are not the majority because the lines will fall away, the average color will be brown as we all mix over the next generations, giving us less reason to fight. And we should look forward to it, because that’s been our story so far - broken, impoverished immigrants came here looking for opportunity, and found it through hard work and smart thinking, and then became a part of our shared tapestry. We were taught to be proud of this, that we were stewards of this tradition in the best, most advanced country in the world.

    And now, well. The basest instincts of people have been brought to the surface and America now stands as an openly white nationalist, isolationist, fascist-tinged autocracy where the ideals I grew up with seem long antiquated.

    So yeah hard not to feel ashamed of what’s happened to our shared identity in just a few decades.

  • 1984@lemmy.today
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    9 hours ago

    I dont identify with my country. Im just a resource so they can collect taxes. I think their decisions are stupid and childish but its like watching babies trying to build a house.

    Best you can do is to focus on your own life.

    • Best you can do is to focus on your own life.

      Lol that’s why my parents say to me. That trying to change anything in politics is pointless, futile, that, in a hypothetical revolution, I’ll never get to live to see such a hypothetical victory…

      I mean I kinda get it, my parents don’t want their kids to die in some war…

      • explodicle@sh.itjust.works
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        5 hours ago

        Direct action my friend. Unionize, participate in mutual aid, opt out of their economy as best as you can. Wars are won by supply chains, not by dead idealists.

  • tree_frog_and_rain@lemmy.world
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    15 hours ago

    Well this last election really broke me from thinking of myself as an American. I just happen to live here.

    Because the truth is our democracy is managed by oligarch propaganda. And our votes mean very little outside of local elections.

    A vote for Trump and a vote for Harris were both going to continue the harms of the MIC and the fossil fuel industry. Yes, Trump is an accelerant. And I voted not to add gasoline.

    But the fire was going to burn one way or the other.

    Anyway, I think folks that feel ashamed still believe that their voice matters. Which is by design of the political and business class.

    • czardestructo@lemmy.world
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      7 hours ago

      I feel similarly and to expand a bit its more the fact that second time around electing this fool proves that that majority of Americans are either horrible people or useful idiots which is incredibly depressing to know with certainty. For me, first time around was a fluke, second time is reality. I’m exploring citizenship elsewhere as a backup plan.

    • flamiera@kbin.melroy.org
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      13 hours ago

      With all of the attempts to dismantle voting booths and artificially mess with the results every freaking election, why even bother voting anymore?

      It’s like we tell the naysayers about voting as to why voting at all in America is pointless. But they still cling to some hope that they’re heard. Well guess what? When a candidate can still win by Electoral College despite the popular majority, that alone tells you how little your little voices mean. When an election can be won by stupid points.

  • Crackhappy@lemmy.world
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    18 hours ago

    I grew up in Indonesia, my sister is from Java, my brother is from Singapore. I’m natively from California, and I’m a huge white boy. I am ashamed that the country of the free, the country of the brave who had bounteous arms to welcome the downtrodden and abused of the world is no longer that place. Instead it’s the land of the secret police, tbe land of a pedophile traitor president who can’t stand any kind of criticism because he’s a fucking coward who dodged military service.

  • nagaram@startrek.website
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    16 hours ago

    I don’t have pride in my government or its actions.

    It was actively causing a lot of harm for most of its existence and is now turbo charging its ability to enshittify the world.

    The LEAST I can do is make it clear we’re not all in support of this shit.

    Love the country and people though. Lots of cool forests to roam and lots of people who don’t suck.

  • flamiera@kbin.melroy.org
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    15 hours ago

    I haven’t felt very patriotic or proud of my country in over 25 years, since I began to slowly understand politics and how things worked within my country. I feel that after everything I’ve read, everything I’ve heard about, everything I verified myself by researching and everything everyone has gone through in it with the bads. You can say my control stick has been snapped off and I’m permanently unpatriotic and ashamed to represent my country, knowing the damage that has been done internally as a country and externally everywhere else in the world.

    I know it’s not my fault, I just do what I can, I pay my taxes knowing it’s being pissed away, I work jobs I didn’t like doing to feel like I’m contributing despite it not being ultimately worth it because I am helping sustain the motion of this unworthy country. I have voted Sanders, Sanders, Harris in my voting record. And still, the assholes won in the end. But then I feel like, that shit doesn’t matter because our track record as a country has shown that the system is in favor of said assholes if they’re cunning enough to take advantage of them and that’s what we’ve witnessed many times.

    All the while knowing that half of the population in this country, is dead set in taking the rest of us down with them in every negative decision made. While still trying to tell us it is our fault.

  • Ms. ArmoredThirteen@lemmy.zip
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    21 hours ago

    I feel deeply embarrassed about being from the US. It’s like hanging out with a group of friends out of necessity, later realizing they were all assholes, and trying to come to terms with the fact you spent so many years with them. I live outside the US now and I’m even more embarrassed to be from there. Every time there’s some culture shock my takeaway is either “wow how did I normalize this broken aspect of the US” or “I wish I was from somewhere that didn’t do those things to that person’s country”.

    I also feel embarrassed and guilty over getting out of the US. I worked in tech and now I’m living off tech savings to start a life outside the US. I left my friends behind many of them are struggling financially, I left my community behind many of which are actively homeless, I chose to leave. Sure I’m leaving in part because my trans ass is on the chopping block but I see a lot of trans people fight harder instead of flee. I fought for so many years though and I couldn’t keep doing it so I left. The US did this to my community, made me confront choices I never wanted to make, I’m disgusted by having paid taxes to the war machine, and I justify working in tech as a way out of there but really I feel guilty over choosing to buy into that side of the US too so I could secure personal safety.

    • KelvarCherry@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      20 hours ago

      Living in the USA myself, I feel shame at how I normalized and rationalized the horrible aspects of this country. I’d already been a minimalist and was anti-consumerism from before I was an adult; but I had downplayed the severity of our systemic violence until it hit me personally. Above all I wish I was doing more to fight this system, like the people you described.

      For as long as I am alive I will stay in the USA. I’m not going to give up on holding out here, as miserable as I’ve felt this last year. I’d like to believe something I do may someday inspire others who are braver and have more resources to do something more concrete.

    • Corporal_Punishment@feddit.uk
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      20 hours ago

      Don’t feel guilty for seeing the signs and getting out whilst you still can. Millions of people throughout history haven’t been as fortunate.

      Once Trump and Project 2025 is done with immigrants you can bet your arse the pendulum will swing onto LGBQT people in earnest