Seattle area trans women need to start carrying guns and hitting the range…
One of the hard truths that members of majority groups struggle to internalize is that for many minority groups, the 2nd Amendment really doesn’t exist.
See the case of CeCe McDonald. She was being attacked and assaulted by a group of bigots. Her life was in danger. She defended herself and killed her attacker. The prosecutor didn’t accept her right to self defense and threw the book at her. Facing the prospect of murder charges, she pled down to second degree manslaughter. She was then forced to spend 3.5 years in a male prison. One of her surviving attackers was charged with second-degree assault and got out on time served.
Or consider the case of Jaia Cruz under very similar circumstances. The DA through the book at her and she was vilified in the media.
If you are a trans woman and you use lethal force to defend yourself, you can be sure of a few things:
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The local prosecutor will take a very dim view of the member of such a maligned minority group daring to defend themselves. Prosecutors and most law enforcement are not friends to trans people. They view trans people as innately lower on the social totem pole, and that they need to know their place. A trans person using lethal force to defend themselves? That’s like a black man in the Jim Crow South using lethal force to defend themselves against white violence. To most prosecutors, trans people are only good for prostitution, porn, and mockery. One using lethal force is an affront to everything they believe in.
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Your self defense claim will not be accepted. The book will be thrown at you. You will be charged with murder.
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The press will demonize you, especially once the right wing tabloids learn of the story. Seriously. Look with your own eyes at how trans women who dare to defend themselves are treated by the media. Your act of desperate self-preservation will be portrayed as you stabbing someone because they didn’t respect your pronouns.
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If you go to trial, the jury will not be sympathetic to you. Trans people are unpopular, and there’s nothing more unpopular than a villainized minority group member daring to leave their place and kill one of their “betters,” even in self-defense.
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You will likely have to plea out. If you’re trans, you probably don’t have the money for a good lawyer. And even if you do, you will face an uphill battle. The prosecution will portray you as a radical transgender nihilist who murdered someone because they didn’t respect your pronouns, when you were actually just trying to save your own life.
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Before and during trial, you will be held in pre-trial detention. You will likely be denied bail. You will be housed in a prison with men. There you likely be v-coded. The jail staff will place you in a cell as a reward to another prisoner. Someone who helps the guards out in one way or another will be rewarded by having a woman placed in their cell, you. You will be repeatedly raped by this person. If you resist, the prison guards will punish you for it. You will be beaten by the guards and then placed in solitary confinement. If you kill your rapist, you will be charged with a second count of murder. You will be regularly raped your entire stay in prison. These conditions will continue if you are convicted and must serve a long sentence.
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No Second Amendment groups will come to your aid and help fund your defense or raise awareness for your act of self defense. They only do that sort of thing for straight white men.
In practice, if you are a trans woman, the 2nd Amendment doesn’t actually exist as a tool of self defense. Gun rights folks love to say “better judged by twelve than carried by six.” But what they forget is that there are fates in this world that are worse than death.
McDonald’s case is pretty uniquely unjust and shouldn’t be used to encourage trans women to not defend themselves
Why not? Again, I repeat, trans Americans do not really have 2nd Amendment rights. They’re purely theoretical; they do not exist in practice. She defended herself, and look what happened. If you are a trans person and use lethal force to defend yourself, you WILL be made an example of just like she was. Prosecutors wanted to send the message that trans people shouldn’t get uppity and resist their abusers. They did that to CeCe, and they’ll do that to you.
There is a reason most all guides on LGBT self defense focus on things other than using weapons for self-defense. They focus on thing like traveling in groups and retreating. There is also a reason it’s an ongoing debate over whether police officers should be allowed at Pride. The first Pride was a riot against evil police.
The problem with using lethal force to defend yourself is that doing so inevitably requires interfacing with the justice system. And that justice system is just as likely to abuse a trans person as the bigot that assaulted them.
As a trans person, if you use lethal force to defend yourself, you are signing yourself up for years of daily sexual assault. That is the cold hard reality.
You only want to focus on the defense part, in the abstract, but you’re completely ignoring what that actually looks like in the real world.
As a trans woman myself, this is one of the reasons I don’t carry a firearm. In almost any situation trying to retreat is much better option than trying to stand my ground. And even if there is no where to retreat, again, there are fates in this world that are worse than death.
If you use a gun to defend yourself the alternative if you dont have the gun is generally assumed to be rape or death or both. What happens after is another question, but you have a right to obtain and carry a gun to use it to protect yourself.
Well trans women don’t have the luxury of casually dismissing what comes after. Again, trans people do not actually have 2nd amendment rights. In practice it is not legal for us to use firearms in self defense.
I’m not casually dismissing what comes after, I’m saying it’s still better than the alternative. Also for the record, I am a trans woman who has guns.
I get what you’re saying, and you can make your own decisions. This is a personal thing that people need to balance their own shitty options. But for me at least, I would rather be dead than spend years in a rape dungeon.
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It’s a bummer how the response to these sorts of stories always turns into “victims should be doing this or that,” because why the hell does someone need to learn how to be effectively violent in order to just goddamn exist in this world, but I have to admit this isn’t bad advice.
One other thing I would suggest trans women do is organize and travel with groups whenever possible. Because a) one armed person is still really vulnerable to being ambushed and subdued before they can do anything, if you have at least two people you can watch each other’s backs, b) finding the good people who live in your neighborhood and helping each other out is a lifehack for so so so many things (childcare, learning new recipes, home improvement, saving money by getting donated clothes and kids toys and stuff, etc.).
https://youtube.com/@squidtips
He is on the front lines protecting trans folks in Seattle.
Never heard of him before but he seems awesome, thanks!
I wish there were a group of cis men who would be willing to open-carry where it’s legal, on demand, and accompany any trans person to and from anywhere they gotta go. I’d do it if I weren’t a pacifist, but maybe it’s still useful even to just have a walking buddy.
It’s a shame that this is where we are as a society, but then again, I’m just using the same argument I’ve been fed my whole life about guns being critical towards creating a more polite society.
Skip the middle man (literally) and arm the trans community.
I do not disagree, but, not every trans person wants to carry a weapon — their existence should just be respected like any other person around here. I mention my thought because those people still need protection, for both their physical and emotional safety.
Idk. Being trans is hard enough, and being a cis white het man is pretty much easy mode comparatively. My thought was moreso that trans people really deserve it that we lean in more using the things we know we have at our disposal. I don’t claim whiteness, but I am unquestionably white if asked by other white people, and I know for a fact that white dudes are much more likely to treat me with respect off the bat. I don’t like that, but I can exploit it to keep people who are just trying to live their fucking life in peace safe. I can’t imagine a more stereotypically ‘American’ cause than that.
community
This part is key. Organized mutual defense (and other kinds of mutual aid).
I spoke to a few people about this since commenting, and this is essentially the response I got back — this kind of thing does already exist, but it has typically been organized by ciswomen for transwomen on a community basis — I. E., strong moderation and vetting and familiarity prevents abuse.
So, I’m guessing the better direction for random cis men who want to organize would be to create a chapterized organization that protects or provides physical barriers around places trans people need to enter and may be prevented from doing so by rioters or violent dissidents. My immediate thought is to protect the doctors and patients who give care to trans youth, and just make an email, text, or Fediverse alert system that dispatches people near an area if a credible report appears of that kind of need.
I think, that way, it helps separate communications between trans folks and cis folks for safety reasons, but the needful is still done and everyone comes away feeling better and more united. I feel like that first part is really necessary to prevent opportunistic abuse.
I’d be down to do that, but it doesn’t just have to be cis men. A gun should be enough of a deterrent for almost anyone regardless of who it’s on.
guns being critical to creating a polite society
Generally no–except where fascists are involved, then absolutely yes.
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should cis Men offer to walk trans women home? can an outreach like this be networked and would it be safer for them?
I am genuinely not sure how that kind of outreach would work, or how to protect anything that is out there from bigots weaponizing it, but I recognize that there’s a need and that cis men like myself (especially those of us with some height on us) have a surprising amount of power to prevent other cis dudes from fucking around.
I am not much for toxic masculinity, but I’ve spent enough time embroiled in it to know that groups of guys will back off anyone who they think might have a weapon. Hell, I’ve personally seen gangbangers actively ward other gangbangers off from cat-calling a woman wearing a wedding ring. I learned later that this is common wisdom because the potential damage that a scorned husband can cause is ridiculous. I think there is something to just utilizing that effect for, y’know, good instead of evil.
I’ve never organized anything before but it seems like it might be easy to do. post flyers at libraries, gay bars, or universities maybe? places where chuds just usually don’t go without an explicit reason.
Hard thing is finding cis men who carry and have time to donate or the interest to help. And then the potential for bad actors too. I wouldn’t want to suggest white male savior antics that just end up being more dangerous
It might work best as a paid service. That was my initial idea, but even people who can’t afford protection deserve it so I scratched my initial response. I guess hit up colleges with flyers. That’s probably your best bet to find allies.
dang. I feel like the people who need it the most are ones with less money for a cab or something. there might be groups in Seattle that might find it. trans inclusive politicians looking for an optics opportunity or any religious groups that haven’t caught the MAGA brain syphilis?
That was my train of thought exactly. The people with the least amount of money are the ones most at risk, but advertising just to allies without letting the MAGA folk know is a challenge.
ARM UP.
As a minority in America, 100% agree and also take classes including active drills because speaking as a hunter, you will need to learn to regulate yourself in a even low stakes situations.
And hunker down. If I was trans I’d basically be a ghost right now for self preservation.
It’s abhorrent that things are at this point, but you gotta protect yourself.
Fuck no. I’m proud to be out. If they want trouble, the queens are gonna make it a scene 😘
Washington, and especially Seattle, should be a safe place to be yourself. These monsters are the ones who need to hide what they are.
They are being attacked in a gay mecca. Hiding the fact that they are here and who they are is exactly what these fucks want.
Arm up, get allies on board is more in the line with the seattle ethos. We don’t put up with that shit around here:
No, these fucks want all trans people dead, not for them to be unseen.
It’s easier to participate in a resistance if you’re not broadcasting that you’re in the group they’re trying to exterminate.
I don’t think thats an option for everybody–even cis women who dress wrong or are very tall get caught up in transphobic fervor sometimes.
You get your rights by making people afraid to take them from you–not by hiding. Doubly so when fascists are involved.
Edit: everyone saying trans people should just hide: please remember that not every trans person has passing privilege. Even some cis women don’t by current standards. Unless you’re willing to hide them in your attic pay for all their needs because they can’t go to work and take care of their emotional well being entirely out of your own pocket–please shut the fuck up. Even aside from the fact this is not the time for that: please shut the fuck up.
Sometimes retreating is the best strategy, such as when the government is ramping up to exterminate you.
I never said that trans people shouldn’t fight for their rights, but you have to be alive to effectively fight fascism.
This is literally the worst possible time to retreat–for those that even can, some cannot
No, this is the best possible time to retreat. They’re solidifying their surveillance state and preparing to point the lens at trans people. Those who can should be minimizing their online presence at the very least.
Trans people aren’t going to have any progression on their rights until fascism is defeated. Full stop.
I think you’re making the mistake of thinking that more people care about trans people than actually do. Trans people are a fraction of a percent of the population, and they don’t have the numbers to rally a meaningful public fight against the current regime.
Right now isn’t the time to stick your neck out. It’s the time to start building safety networks and organizing to stay safe.
Don’t trust myself sadly
If you are against or incapable of owning a firearm, I will recommend you purchase a high powered flashlight. You can blind a would be a tracker from further away then you think, especially if you get a flashlight that is so strong the flashlight nerds call them “throwers”.
I dont know if lemmy had flashlight nerds, but reddit does for sure.
o/
It seems so bizarre because generally Seattle is one of the most trans-positive cities in the US.
I’m sure the people who did this came from outside the area. The example was on Capital Hill, a place known to be a gay neighborhood.
Capitol Hill has been a magnet for right-wingers coming to Seattle this year - most notably an anti-trans rally by a Christian theocratic organization from Spokane that led to counter-protestors clashing with police.
It’s a pretty famous neighborhood for its queer population as well as the Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone (CHOP/CHAZ) during the 2020 protests, which makes it a target for right-wing agitators despite its strong local community.
Always how it is. Philly is an amazingly, deeply progressive place that started what we would consider today’s interpretation of “progressive” way way back in 1812. Racists and bigots absolutely exist in the city but for the most part, every instance of political violence in the past 10 years has either been actual Nazis (Patriot Front) shipping in via U-Haul, or goobers from the outer counties driving in specifically to shoot guns at windows and signs and drive out of the city with their plates covered, using one of those friggin remote controlled piezoelectric tint plate blockers
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piezoelectric tint plate blockers
I’m surprised I’ve never even thought about this. That’s actually kind of brilliant… In an illegal way
They’re all over AliExpress and TEMU. People use them mostly to cheat bridge tolls, lol.
Formerly known to be a gay neighborhood, to be fair, but still generally a very inclusive area.
When did it stop being gay af?
Gradually over the last 10-15 years or so?
It was pretty darn gay in 2018, which was the last time I lived in Seattle.
Regardless, those people probably came up from Renton 🤪
it’s still super gay, and by far the highest density of trans people I’ve ever lived among
If it’s anything like sf–when ut got too expensive and tech-fasch
It’s still near Oregon.
Jesus Christ, the random bystanders joining in on the queer bashing too.
Yeah, but in at least one of these a random bystander high school student jumped in to defend a trans person, and in another a group of bystanders showed up right after an attack to help out. Most people are good, it just doesn’t take very many bad ones to make terrible things happen.
Bit of a silver lining to some really shitty incidents, I guess.
why is it always trans women in the news, and not trans men?
A lot of the violence against trans men is in the form of rape/other forms of SA, and we eventually learn not to go to the police when that happens. (Ask me how I know!) So it won’t make the news, either.
There are more MtF transpeople than FtM.
This is not well-supported by a consensus of research.
Because angry men don’t even notice FtM people.
Nothing can prepare you for what it’s like when gross dudes suddenly think they’re in good company and let slip some shit that is so heinous that you can’t even react for a few minutes.
Conscious cismen and transmen know what I mean.
Oh man, the shit I heard from customers at my first job… I wish 17-year-old me was as willing to confront strangers as I am today.
Because they aren’t as much of a threat to patriarchal ideologies, and men’s bodies aren’t as scrutinized.
